Jack Benny shows (and many others) removed from archive.org

[mackdaddyg]

Apparently, Radio Spirits is claiming some kind of copyright infringement and demanding that a lot of old time radio shows (including all Jack Benny shows) be removed from archive.org.

From what I've read, it's all very confusing, but it's really kind of sad. I appreciate them wanting to run a business, but do they really own the rights to ALL of these shows?

Anybody with much more knowledge than I care to chime in?

[LLeff]

Hello again,

Sorry that it's been a while since I had the time to look through the Forum, but I'm trying to catch up in bits and pieces.

So here's the deal. Radio Spirits doesn't own the rights to the Benny shows, but the Benny Estate does. I won't go into the legal details, but suffice it to say that based on California case law, the shows are a "derivative work" of the scripts. So whoever owns the scripts, owns the shows. Jack employed the writers directly, so the scripts are a "work for hire" and the employer owns the results--that being Jack.

Radio Spirits has an exclusive deal with the Benny Estate for distributing the radio shows. Archive.org, or anyone selling the shows on Ebay, or giving them away on their site, does not have the legal right to do so. The IJBFC operates with the endorsement of the Benny Estate, and we don't provide any real competition for Radio Spirits.

So the short answer is yes...Radio Spirits is legitimate in protecting their exclusive.

In the interest of full disclosure...I negotiated that deal between Radio Spirits and the Benny Estate, and independently wrote the liner notes for the most recent RS Benny CD release.

Hope this helps...

[BIGZIPZ]

Radio Spirits is despised by the OTR community largely.

[Maxwell]

Is Radio Spirits the organization that is keeping The Lone Ranger off the air?

[mackdaddyg]

So the short answer is yes...Radio Spirits is legitimate in protecting their exclusive.

Hope this helps...

It does, and I appreciate the info. While I am all for copyrights and the right people getting their proper due, I guess I do have a slight beef with Radio Spirits, only because I feel like they charge WAY too much for their product. Plus, and I will admit this is probably not very cost effective, it would be nice if they provided shows in a more logical order, say chronologically. It can't cost that much to make a cd, and I kinda doubt they do much to improve the sound.

But, I freely admit that I don't know the details. I reckon as long as the shows are being preserved somehow, I can't complain. The sad thing is since sites like archive.org don't have the shows available anymore, I won't be listening to much Jack for a while.

But again, I appreciate the info. Thanks!!

[AnneCr]

I find the issues presented by the intersection of copyright law and modern life (20 & 21st century) fascinating. Real estate doesn't become Public Domain after a fixed time; the Rockefeller fortune didn't become public domain after a fixed time;why should creative works? Copyright law has not even sufficiently adapted to the invention of the Victrola and the Kinetoscope, much less the Internet.
It cheers me to know that Radio Spirits pays the Benny estate, just as it pleases me that Conde Nast (owners of Street and Smith) to this day pays the estate of Walter Gibson (a/k/a Maxwell Grant) for any revenues from The Shadow Magazine stories. I wish that Radio Spirits did a lot of things differently, and if someone else can show that they and not Radio Spirits are legitimate copyright holders to a work, that is fine by me, too, but someone deserves to be paid.

[LLeff]

Radio Spirits is despised by the OTR community largely.

I know that the folks at Radio Spirits used a bunch of "strong arm" tactics with dealers around eight or ten years ago and created a lot of ill will. I am happy to say that the evolution of the company ownership over the years has led to a much better management team now--at least, IMO.

I'm not asking you to "like" RS...just didn't want you to think that I've "gone to the dark side."

[mdclimber]

Unfortunately, it looks like my kids will be getting a love of Gunsmoke, X Minus One, Sherlock Holmes and Fibber McGee and Molly instead of Jack Benny. As much as I love Jack Benny, Burns and Allen, Phil Harris, etc., I'm not dropping $40 for 20 episodes. That's a ridiculous price. I haven't listened ot the Jack Benny Show in a couple months now. It depressed me at first because I love the show. But you know what? There are other terriffic shows out there that don't cost me $2 an episode. I listen to OTR now (as a 40 year old) because my grandfather and father listened to these shows on tape or on NPR and I loved them. When I found the old Jack Benny shows on archive.org, I was thrilled! I could once again listen to all the shows as much as I wanted. I passed along that joy by sharing them with my kids, my wife, my friends, anyone who was in my car. There are dozens of people who had never heard of Jack Benny before that listened and enjoyed his show.

But 20-30 years ago you had no choice but to buy the oldtime radio shows. You accepted that because you had no alternatives. But this is a different world now. People know what they can access on the internet. And when they cannot get it, they see what they CAN get online versus what they have to buy. And they will go with the free shows because there are still a lot of great ones available. Eventually what Radio Spirits will do is kill off the current and future Jack Benny audience and his show will fade into obscurity. Sad.

[jbennyfan39]

There is a free app on Droid called Old Timer Radio that I have been able to download that plays a ton of old Jack Benny radio shows. Has anyone else tried it? It doesn't always have the greatest sound quality, but it's a job for me to be able to listen on my cell phone every day on the train to and from work. And it's free.

[jbennyfan39]

There is a typo in my last post, I meant to say it is a JOY to listen to these shows on the train (or whenever else I want to listen)!